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October 1st, 2017, 04:13 AM   #1
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Energy levels

What are the relationships in energy levels between protons and electrons?


Theory suggests that it is a positive and negative node creating the particle.

What if the proton is an ambiguity and it has the characteristics which make the electron want to mimic it.

Perhaps if you could manipulate the proton, the electron will become super charged because of its desire to mimic the proton and its desire to reach the ambiguous state of the proton.

This creates the attraction...

Are there any cases of mimicry in physics?

I observe mimicry day in and day out.

I have never seen an example in physics however.

Last edited by skipjack; October 12th, 2017 at 01:47 AM.
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October 1st, 2017, 04:15 AM   #2
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Perhaps if we ask the question how do we make a proton, an electron?

And an electron a proton?
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October 1st, 2017, 04:34 AM   #3
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Mimicry implies some sort of intention or will or at least genetically directed action as with the cuckoo.

Inanimate matter such as electrons and protons have not such direction.

It may be useful for you to know that protons and electrons belong to quite different classes of particle with quite different rules of physical behaviour.

Protons are not fundamental particles, but are an assembly of fundamental particles; they belong to a class called bosons.

Electrons are fundamental particles that cannot be broken down or assembled from other more fundamental particles and belong to a class called fermions.

Last edited by skipjack; October 12th, 2017 at 01:48 AM.
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October 1st, 2017, 04:45 AM   #4
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The sun is the sun, I don't buy this fermions and bosons.

But I'll have a read.

Maybe if you can fiddle with the structure like a hydrocarbon chain, you could achieve this.To convert the fermions into bosons.

Last edited by Dorky0; October 1st, 2017 at 04:53 AM.
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October 1st, 2017, 05:09 AM   #5
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Maybe create a cell with the structure manipulation from the atom.

We can split it we can fuse it.

But to manipulate it to create energy?
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October 1st, 2017, 08:21 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Dorky0 View Post
The sun is the sun, I don't buy this fermions and bosons.

But I'll have a read.

Maybe if you can fiddle with the structure like a hydrocarbon chain, you could achieve this.To convert the fermions into bosons.
There is plenty of experimental evidence that there are particles that are fermions (spin 1/2, 3/2, 5/2, etc. particles) and bosons (spin 0, 1, 2, etc.). You can find any number of sources for information for this. They exist.

The only theory in Physics that deals with changing fermions into bosons is called Supersymmetry. According to this theory fermions have bosonic counterparts.

Also, as studiot says, protons are not fundamental particles. They are made from a mix of quarks and gluons. A fundamental supersymmetric particle does not exist for the proton. And it wouldn't be the electron in any event.

-Dan
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October 2nd, 2017, 06:32 AM   #7
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What are the relationship in energy levels between protons and electrons.
For electrons, energy levels refer to the potential energy of a particular electron orbital, which is generally found by considering the quantum numbers of the electron orbital relative to the ground state and the orbiting body. The interactions are very difficult to calculate for anything other than a hydrogen atom, but models do exist.

Protons do not have orbitals because they are nucleons, so the concept of "energy levels" isn't particularly relevant unless you're talking about molecular nuclei, which is a very different beast to electron orbitals. In that case you worry about things like alpha-clustering or proton/alpha-orbitals, but the mathematics is completely different to electron orbitals; that's nuclear physics rather than particle physics.

Quote:
Theory suggests that it is a positive and negative node creating the particle.

What if the proton is an ambiguity and it has the characteristics which make the electron want to mimic it.
This sounds like pseudoscience to me. The rest of the post is also fiction.

The electron is a fundamental particle (a lepton) and the proton is a hadron made of two up quarks and a down quark (uud), bound together by gluons. The differences between the two particles are well understood, at least regarding quantum numbers and interactions with other particles. The main unsolved problems with protons are associated with the electric charge radius and how its spin is distributed among the constituent quarks and gluons. That's because it delves into many-body interactions at the subatomic level, which are extremely difficult problems and current computers still struggle to calculate everything in a feasible time-frame. That means that you have to introduce tricks and approximations, which start to affect the results of your simulation code.

I think you're trying to invent ways that might describe why the electromagnetic force is attractive between particles with opposite signs of their charge quantum numbers. You might find your answer if you look up quantum field theory, gauge theory or particle physics. Basically, all interactions can be modelled as either field equations (QFT) or as particle interactions. In the latter case, the EM force is characterized by the exchange of virtual photons between the two charged particles. The resulting exchange of momentum in the photon/lepton interaction gives the change in motion.
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October 11th, 2017, 01:44 PM   #8
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okay if they are made up of Bosons and Fermions

if you apply e=mc^2 to them, within an atom,

and bind it to a light wave - i don't know where I got this from btw..

would it be possible to bind an atom to a light wave from the sun or a lightbulb to make it travel at the speed of light, in this way we could get energy.

From an atom.

waves have positive and negative wavelengths, perhaps we could apply this to an atomic attraction and debind the atom so that the negative particles are with the positive waves, and the positive particles are with the negative waves.

I'd draw a picture if you don't follow.
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October 11th, 2017, 01:59 PM   #9
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maybe experimentally if you shone a very powerful laser onto a hydrogen atom and the positive wavelength would inevitably interact with the negative part of the atom, and vice versa.

giving out energy on the other end.

we would need something faster maybe? so that it doesn't get absorbed but it debinds it. or an x-ray laser???

just drawing pictures on this sheet of paper,

i think that the amplitude of the light wave would shorten if it were possible, because of the attraction of positives and negatives in the atoms along the troughs which could give rise to energy.

energy being a concentrated wave because of the bind to the atom.

something along these lines

energy from the sun is not energy because it's free - just kidding!!!

Last edited by Dorky0; October 11th, 2017 at 02:13 PM.
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October 11th, 2017, 03:15 PM   #10
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What do you mean by "negative part of the atom"? Do you mean the electron clouds?

Remember the electron shell can only interact with radiation for certain frequencies. It does not matter what the strength of the laser is. (The nucleus can also do this, but again there are specific frequencies.)

I don't know what you mean about "binding" an atom to the light? A photon can be absorbed by an atom but it will quickly emit a new one to go back to ground state. The only exception I can think of is when we bombard the atom by an intense beam of light at the right frequencies. This is how optical pumping is done in a laser.

What the heck is a "negative wavelength?" There is no such thing. The wavelength is, essentially, the distance between two maxima of the wave. By definition is can't be negative.

Quote:
we would need something faster maybe
Faster than light? C'mon!

Ask any questions you like but you need to brush up on the basics. You are trying to work at a more advanced level than you have the knowledge for.

-Dan
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