June 29th, 2017, 03:43 AM  #1 
Member Joined: May 2017 From: France Posts: 57 Thanks: 1  The physics of bags
Hello, I would like to describe a physics of the bags, but if that already exists there is no need to reinvent the hot water. Indeed, to base his theory on logic is dangerous, because it is dead or doomed to die, not in a long time. The physics of the bags is an analog of ZFC, but constructed from the physical model of the bags and validate by this model, instead of constructing a theory and asking the question of the model, I start from the model and tries to describe A theory (just like in physics). Thank you. PS: I am an ET (Theoretical Experimenter or Enigmologist). Cordially. The french version : Salut, J'aimerais décrire une physique des sacs, mais si cela existe déjà inutile de réinventer l'eau chaude. En effet faire reposer sa théorie sur la logique est dangereux, car elle est morte ou vouée à mourrir, dans pas longtemps. La physique des sacs est un analogue de ZFC, mais construit à partir du modéle physique des sacs et valider par ce modéle, au lieu de construire une théorie et de se poser la question du modéle, je part du modéle et essaie d'en décrire une théorie (tout comme en physique). Merci. PS : Je suis un ET (Expérimentateur Théorique ou Enigmologue). Cordialement. 
June 29th, 2017, 06:50 AM  #2 
Senior Member Joined: Apr 2014 From: Glasgow Posts: 2,086 Thanks: 700 Math Focus: Physics, mathematical modelling, numerical and computational solutions  I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'bags'. Do you mean literal bags (containers like rucksacks, luggage or carrier bags) or do you mean something else?

June 29th, 2017, 08:02 AM  #3 
Senior Member Joined: Feb 2016 From: Australia Posts: 1,511 Thanks: 505 Math Focus: Yet to find out.  
June 29th, 2017, 08:11 AM  #4  
Senior Member Joined: Dec 2012 From: Hong Kong Posts: 853 Thanks: 311 Math Focus: Stochastic processes, statistical inference, data mining, computational linguistics  Quote:
 
June 29th, 2017, 09:08 AM  #5 
Math Team Joined: Jul 2011 From: Texas Posts: 2,700 Thanks: 1358 
Physics bags ... paper or plastic?

June 29th, 2017, 09:39 AM  #6 
Math Team Joined: Oct 2011 From: Ottawa Ontario, Canada Posts: 11,655 Thanks: 740  
June 29th, 2017, 12:52 PM  #7 
Senior Member Joined: Aug 2012 Posts: 1,704 Thanks: 454 
I've heard the term bags meaning multisets; that is, "sets" that contain the same item more than once, such as $[1,1,2]$. I don't know anything about them but I think they're studied in computer science.

July 3rd, 2017, 09:49 AM  #8 
Math Team Joined: Jan 2015 From: Alabama Posts: 2,944 Thanks: 797 
It would help if Datier would come back and clarify what is meant.

July 3rd, 2017, 12:23 PM  #9 
Member Joined: May 2017 From: France Posts: 57 Thanks: 1 
Hi, It's like a set theory, with a lot of empty set (empty bags). And two bag is the same, if "le contenu" is the same and "le contenant" too. Cordially. 
July 6th, 2017, 09:18 AM  #10 
Senior Member Joined: Apr 2014 From: Glasgow Posts: 2,086 Thanks: 700 Math Focus: Physics, mathematical modelling, numerical and computational solutions 
Okay... with a little bit of further reading, I think I understand what you mean. I was thinking of electron orbitals in atoms because they discrete mathematics plays a roll and there are sometimes sets of possible states, but I don't think they are multisets because the Pauli Exclusion will prevent particles with the same quantum numbers existing in the same system, so you'll have unique sets in that case. You might have more luck with BoseEinstein condensates or other bosonic systems that are not constrained by the Pauli exclusion principle, but then you'll have a system which has continuous states rather than discrete states, so set theory isn't particularly relevant for those either. The wikipedia page on multisets (thanks for the link) hints at statistical mechanics and partition functions, spcifically with regards to cumulantgenerating functions. I think that's probably a good physical phenomenon where multiset concepts are relevant. In those cases you have a partition function which is used to calculate, for a given distribution, the set of possible thermodynamic states a system of particles has. certain descriptors of those functions are multisets apparently 

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