My Math Forum Proton to Electron Mass Ratio

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 February 5th, 2016, 10:17 PM #1 Newbie   Joined: Feb 2016 From: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Math Focus: Calculus, System and Signal Analysis Proton to Electron Mass Ratio Equation for the proton to electron mass ratio: $$\mu={m_p\over m_e} = {\alpha^2\over\pi r_pR_H}=1836.15267$$ $m_p=$ mass of proton $m_e=$ mass of electron $\alpha=$ fine-structure constant $r_p=$ radius of proton $R_H=$ Rydberg constant comes from combining the Rydberg equation for electron mass: $$m_e={2R_Hh\over c\alpha^2}$$ $c=$ speed of light $h=$ Planck's constant with Nassim Haramein's equation for the proton mass-radius relationship: $$m_pr_p=4\ell m_{\ell}$$ $\ell=\sqrt{\hbar G\over c^3}=$ Planck length $m_{\ell}=\sqrt{\hbar c\over G}=$ Planck mass $\hbar={h\over 2\pi}$ = Reduced Planck's constant $G=$ Universal Gravitational constant CODATA value for ${m_p\over m_e}=1836.15267389(17)$ calculated mass ratio using my derived equation: 1836.15267(421379) <- only good to 9 digits due to limited resolution of CODATA for fundamental constants. (By the way, this is confirmation to the resolution of the proton radius puzzle: $$r_p=0.841235640294664 fm$$ ) Mark Rohrbaugh - February 6, 2016 Last edited by phxmarker; February 5th, 2016 at 11:14 PM.
 February 8th, 2016, 04:17 PM #2 Math Team   Joined: Jan 2015 From: Alabama Posts: 3,264 Thanks: 902 What is your point? This is a simple algebraic manipulation, but it is NOT a "resolution of the proton radius puzzle" because you assumed that when you used "Nassim Haramein's equation for the proton mass-radius relationship". Last edited by skipjack; February 8th, 2016 at 04:57 PM.
 February 8th, 2016, 04:30 PM #3 Math Team     Joined: May 2013 From: The Astral plane Posts: 2,305 Thanks: 962 Math Focus: Wibbly wobbly timey-wimey stuff. Now that Country Boy brings it up, just what is the proton radius "puzzle?" I'm not aware of any problems here, except perhaps for calculating it directly from QCD. That's likely to be a nasty one. -Dan
 February 8th, 2016, 06:36 PM #4 Newbie   Joined: Feb 2016 From: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Math Focus: Calculus, System and Signal Analysis The proton puzzle is the proton radius measurement discrepancy problem that was revealed when researchers went in to refine the CODATA measurement for the proton radius with a new measurement technique (supposedly more accurate). In 2010 & 2013, muonic hydrogen was used and the proton radius came out to be about 0.8412fm which is 4% smaller than the CODATA value of 0.8768fm for the proton radius. This is a major unresolved problem in physics, and the relationships above clearly show Nassim Haramein's equation not only predicts the proton radius, it is also a key part of the first accurate equation for the proton to electron mass ratio based on fundamental physical constants rooted in a geometrical and information theory based analytical derivation approach (i.e., the derivation is physics based, not numerology). And this is the first and only physics based equation and it is 100% accurate. You cannot find any other equation for the proton to electron mass ratio that is physics based. The point is this is the first equation for the proton to electron mass ratio that is based on fundamental physical constants and it agrees with - MATCHES - measured data. Do you know how long people have been looking for an analytical equation for the proton to electron mass ratio? Last edited by phxmarker; February 8th, 2016 at 07:35 PM.
February 8th, 2016, 07:12 PM   #5
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by phxmarker The proton puzzle is the proton radius measurement discrepancy problem that was revealed when researchers went in to refine the CODATA measurement for the proton radius with a new measurement technique. In 2010 & 2013, muonic hydrogen was used and the proton radius came out to be about 0.8412fm which is 4% smaller than the CODATA value of 0.8768fm for the proton radius. This is a major unresolved problem in physics, and the relationships above clearly show Nassim Haramein's equation not only predicts the proton radius, it is also a key part of the first accurate equation for the proton to electron mass ratio based on fundamental physical constants rooted in a geometrical and information theory based analytical derivation approach (i.e., the derivation is physics based, not numerology). And this is the first and only physics based equation and it is 100% accurate. You cannot find any other equation for the proton to electron mass ratio that is physics based. The point is this is the first equation for the proton to electron mass ratio that is based on fundamental physical constants and it agrees with measured data. Do you know how long people have been looking for an analytical equation for the proton to electron mass ratio?
It looks like curiosity is going to kill this cat.

Ignoring all the bad stuff I found on the internet about Mr. Haramein and his version of the way Physics works, despite the number of articles he has posted online I have been unable to locate the one in which he derives the $\displaystyle m_p r_p = 4 L m_L$ relationship. I would like to see this derivation as I cannot understand why the RHS has nothing at all to do with a proton.

And there is no such thing as a 100% accurate equation in Physics. It is accurate only insofar as data supports it. And clearly data cannot be 100% accurate!

-Dan

 February 8th, 2016, 07:56 PM #6 Newbie   Joined: Feb 2016 From: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Math Focus: Calculus, System and Signal Analysis Haramein does have a derivation for $m_pr_p=4Lm_L$. This is the algebraic form, however, there is a geometric form. A verbal description is in his paper: http://hiup.org/wp-content/uploads/2...13PRRI3363.pdf I agree with you on the 100% comment. I do believe the equation for the proton to electron mass ratio matches the measured data to about 9 decimal places, and likely it matches to 12 or more digits. The calculation's accuracy is limited by the number of digits of the accuracy of the measured speed of light. (using all CODATA values, I found c to be the limiting term for digits of resolution)
 February 9th, 2016, 01:57 AM #7 Senior Member   Joined: Apr 2014 From: Glasgow Posts: 2,164 Thanks: 736 Math Focus: Physics, mathematical modelling, numerical and computational solutions Why are you posting this? What do you want us to do?
February 9th, 2016, 08:12 AM   #8
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by phxmarker Haramein does have a derivation for $m_pr_p=4Lm_L$. This is the algebraic form, however, there is a geometric form. A verbal description is in his paper: http://hiup.org/wp-content/uploads/2...13PRRI3363.pdf I agree with you on the 100% comment. I do believe the equation for the proton to electron mass ratio matches the measured data to about 9 decimal places, and likely it matches to 12 or more digits. The calculation's accuracy is limited by the number of digits of the accuracy of the measured speed of light. (using all CODATA values, I found c to be the limiting term for digits of resolution)
I have done a first approximation read-through of the paper and, whereas the algebra is rather pretty, I have to say that I see no reason to believe its claims.

1) I would be much more comfortable with the concepts if everything were a black hole. There is a Schwarzschild radius for every object but it only has a physical meaning if the object can fit inside of it.

I suppose you could tile any surface with your "Planck areas" but as the proton doesn't actually have a surface I don't see how this could work.

2) If anyone had truly quantized GR I would have heard of it by now, so I doubt it exists. Can you please give me a reference for this paper as well?

-Dan

 February 9th, 2016, 08:29 AM #9 Newbie   Joined: Feb 2016 From: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Math Focus: Calculus, System and Signal Analysis There are a series of papers at Publications | Hawaii Institute for Unified Physics The one on the universal scaling law of matter is important as well as a few of the other papers there. The ideas are giving results, as it can easily be seen with the equation for proton to electron mass ratio. The ideas help solve a few of the unsolved physics problems, so it's kind of important and showing a new direction for physics to take.
February 9th, 2016, 09:08 AM   #10
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by phxmarker There are a series of papers at Publications | Hawaii Institute for Unified Physics The one on the universal scaling law of matter is important as well as a few of the other papers there. The ideas are giving results, as it can easily be seen with the equation for proton to electron mass ratio. The ideas help solve a few of the unsolved physics problems, so it's kind of important and showing a new direction for physics to take.
Okay, the link to the "quantized Schwarzschild solution" goes back to the original paper referenced before. This is not actually a quantum theory...it is merely a patchwork of your Planck units across the Schwarzschild surface. The name of the work is really confusing.

I'll browse the rest later.

-Dan

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# what is approximate ratio of mass of proton and electron

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